I'm saying that the major religions have decided that if God is playing hide and seek that, being God, and being all powerful and all that jazz, he's allowed to do that, and no one would know the difference.

It's not so much that the sandwich has no qualities of existence-it's just that we aren't permitted to observe any of them.

This isn't even my opinion.  Personally, I dispute the "all powerful" clause.  But that's beside the point.  This is what they've said God is.  This is what they choose to believe in.  If you see it as nothing, you can choose to believe that.

There are going to be cases where we know certain statements are True, yet they would be unprovable. 

Worship the mathematicians! The language of maths is bajilion miles ahead of those biologists/chemists/physicists! It holds truths we have yet managed to translated into the messy natural spoken languages. (like the one I'm typing in now!)

Actually string theory shows that there are possible dimenision behind our 3rd dimenision (hence 3-D).  As one of the greatest Scientist of all time had said 'Mathematics should always be proving what science is saying.' Philosophy is very mathematical (one of the reason why I study it/both).  Actually both are very logical (well until you get into Quantum physics then it seems that logic has kind of departed). 

Evolutionary biologist have a hard time explaining how the following were able to do their special tactics (not that they don't have any explanations): Sepia officinalis and Nezara viridula.  When I lived in Greece/Turkey I saw a Sepia Officinalis.  Well, actually I almost missed it! To see it change color so rapidly (they can actually change color faster than a chamelon) and I've been told that they can even change their skin texture.  As for the nezara viridula, they produce a mixture of 5 Alkalines.  As you know Alkalines can produce chemical burns.  The nezara viridula, produces a spray that burns and has a foul ordor.

Either G-D exists in all possible worlds, or HE exists in some but not others, or HE exists in no possible worlds. 

1.  It is possible that G-D exists.

2. If G-D existed in some possible worlds, but not others, then why? Some factor would be causing this change, which would make G-D's existence dependent on that factor.  By definition, G-D is not dependent on anything else for existence.

3. So G-D must exist in every possible world, which includes ours.

I would expect everything in the universe to be explained by science. God created a rational universe that runs off laws and constants he put into place. So even if you could explain why everything in the universe happens and why. You still dont prove God doesnt exist. In fact this would reinforce a religous belief about God.

If God created the Universe and determined the laws and principles it operates on then he knew how every particle would interact, therefore he he knew the Universe would eventually yeild intelligent creatures.

look at it this way God is the greatest scientist of all.

Also an interesting note, hiddenranbir has the diagram of fields arranged by purity. More mathematicians believe in a higher power than any other field. Actually the more to the right you go the more likely you are to believe in a god.

Side note: there are 4 dimensions

1 left and right

2 up and down

3 back and forth

4 time

Logic's not limited in the way you're implying; it can apply to anything you want it to.  And we're not using logic alone to explain the universe: logic in a vacuum is useless.  Logic is a method for inducing new truths or falsehoods based on existing ones.  We are using science foremost to understand the universe; logic is just one of many tools that science can use.

For most of these examples:

you could use logic to induce facts based on existing ones.  The problem with some of these things is that using logic and science leaves people with answers they don't like.  You are right, there is no "proof" that any particular aesthetics or ethics are "true", but that IS the correct answer.  Science and logic isn't failing here.  There's nothing there to prove.  Likewise, there's no need to try to prove that logic or science are "true", since they are not statements in and of themselves.  They are both methods for determining things about the universe.  The only thing we should be concerned with is whether they work correctly on the given domain (understanding the universe), not whether or not they are "true" in a vague metaphysical sense of the word.  As for metaphysical truths - these things don't exist.  Metaphysics is more or less defined as the study of things that are unprovable and have no evidence - it's all just opinions, there is no truth there to try to prove.

But that's not really what the major religions have said God is.  It's what a very small subset of modern-day theological philosophers have said God is.  For the vast majority of people, they are saying that God is an actual physical guy floating around, using magic to perform miracles, making it sunny when they want to have a picnic, and sending gay people to hell.

Aside from that, there are a lot of logical problems and vaguery around the term "all powerful", which you probably see as well.  I guess even if we ignore that, if we define God as this thing that COULD physically effect something or have a quality, but chooses to eternally never actually physically do anything or have any qualities, then I'd say even thinking about that "God" thing is a waste of time.  It's not able/willing to actually affect us in any way, and it's impossible for anyone to know anything at all about it, so there's very little point in spending an entire lifetime making up rules that you think it wants you to follow and structuring your government / church / holy war around these arbitrary rules.

I'll never believe in God!! lol I used to but there are too many terrible things in this world for a God, so loving as the one Catholics/Christians worship, to exist.

If there was a God...(fill in the blank).

If there was a God...why did my beloved cat, Banjo, die at age 7 of heart disease while suffering with a urinary tract infection?  God couldn't save, nor could medicine for we found out about heart disease the day he died.

Yeah so I am in a predicament though...a girl likes me and I her...however she's really religious.  I'm athiest but have no problem with people practicing religion.  I don't know how she would take it if she knew I didn't believe in God.  Thoughts, advice haha?

-Phal

Well, well, well. (why is it 3 'wells' satisfies that configuration?) I see that I am here with a bunch of fallen men with questions about where, when and who they might be. Why hasn't God given us these answers so that we might know what to do with ourselves? The Christian religion says that He has done that in the Spirit-breathed book they call the Bible. One of the certain aspects of the Bible is the disclosure of hell, and that many are on the broad road to that place because of their rejection of the indisribable gift of Jesus Christ, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sins of the world. In human terms, and I suppose that is to say in 'scientific' terms, this is the only explanation that can satisfy all of humanity. This 'thread' could and might go on till the end of time, with a constant changing of contributors as we all die off, one by one or all together, come what may. Be aware however, that God, the everlasting Father  ( a concept we all understand) has painted a flawless picture of who we are in the life of His only begotten Son, the Lord of Lords, the King of Kings, the Light of the world, the Prince of peace, the Redeemer of mankind, the Saviour of the world, the Way, the Truth, the Life...oh, my poor fellow 'users'; I need to go to work. I leave you with this thought, that comes from way back; "God made you so that you might know Him so that you might love Him and that you might serve Him." He call you unto Himself. You either come or you don't. Towards Him is light; away from Him is darkness. Towards Him you will come to Christ. You would be smart come to Christ, for He alone knows what to do with you and the mess that you are. He is from everlasting to everlasting (how scientific can I get?) so He'll get for you all the answers you all might be looking for. For Christ's sake, smaten up. Oceanspray.

The weirdest part of that whole ramble was how at the end you find out it's an ad for Ocean Spray fruit juice.  I like the new tag line though: "For Christ's sake, smarten up.  Ocean Spray." and then there's an x-treme camera closeup on the juice bottle.

PS - you spelled "smarten up" wrong.

Typical a scientist would say that. Mathematics is not proving science. Science is based on observable data. Observations prove their hypothesis. That's it, science should be proving what it is saying with observation. It is just so very convenient and coincidental that mathematics can be so naturally applied. 

Mathematics needs no observational data. It can break the limitations of our sensory capability and truly present truths to us. Truths we have yet to prove, or may never prove - but we'll still know they are true!

The James Clerk Maxwell's field equations established the existence of radio waves before there was any observable proof that science so demands. What the James Clerk Maxwell did was establish mathematics as the arbiter of physical reality and the first to accept in a real sense that language is reality. 

Oooh, I feel like making a thread on language's role in reality now!

In antiquity everybody had their Gods for everything.

In modern times every religion have their own Gods for everything.

Yet nobody as ever seen or touched or seen anything writting by a GOD, as far as I know of course. The bible was written by a man or men. I am a christian that's why I use this exemple. I find it remarkably funny that an all powerful being creates all this and then just dissapears. What's the point? When I hear the answer you just have to have faith, I'm sorry that's a bogus answer to a legetimate question. Faith and trust is earned not given away. If you want my faith then you must earn it. When I see all the wars and conflicts Religion as made in all of the history of Humanity I find it hard to believe that if there is a GOD and with a simple action like giving proof of his existance all this could of been avoided. Because this as not happened I surmised that god does nto exist. Day after day technology disproves most of what was thought to me in the bible. God did not create man as it is said in the book. The only time he supposedly came to earth was when there was no way to proove his existance. It's pretty lame.

So I think that the OP as a good point. I do think that in time we will understand how everything came about. There is no limit to our potential, I think in time we will be the gods.

PS seriously it's all pointless there is no answer right now. Only suppositions.  it's like sombody stating there is 1 billion stars in the universe. Nobody can say for sure anyway. So why bother with it. If there is a GOD he does not want us to know.

some of the points in this thread speak more about the need for further education than for the existence of God.

Spurious Logic, or good Logic based on outdated or false presumptions can only lead to inaccurate and ill fated conclusions.

Heisenberg's uncertainty principle will preclude Man from ever fully understanding the Universe. Man is part of the Universe, and his very observations will sckew the results. For God to Omnipotent, he would have to exist outside the Universe (and therefore not exist IN it) So if God exists, he still doesn't.. even if he does..cause he doesn't

Exactly.

You guys should try just picking up the Bible and reading it. You all talk about reading all this stuff about how God can't be real, well I think that to be a good scientist you must hear and study all sides of the arguement. There are many things in the Bible that make sense. If you guys do a study you will realize that the bible has a lot of stuff in it that explains things that we thought could only be explained by technology. Consider that.